Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign It's Lacey and I'm Lauren and welcome to another episode of the Llamas podcast.
[00:00:11] Speaker B: And today we're gonna like, continue on our reality tv, but we're going to talk a little bit more about Mormon lives today and some of the legal implications that have been on the show.
And then we'll have some newest. This is the end of kind of this little reality series. We'll have some new stuff coming up. And the future.
[00:00:30] Speaker A: Yep.
Before we get started though, Lauren, I did have a question.
So one thing that's kind of come up in the criminal world is the use of AI.
And so we've been working with marketing to find out, like, what we need to do to kind of get ahead of the game with AI and how it's impacting marketing for our firm and other criminal attorneys. So I wanted to see if that is something that's also impacting like estate planning.
You know, kind of what are you seeing with AI and estate planning and how it is fitting into like your realm.
[00:01:07] Speaker B: So I will say this is actually something my law firm is going to be putting out a blog on soon, so definitely check it out. It's a biz law, but so we have seen a lot with AI. A lot of people will go on to chat GPT and say like, especially in the estate and business world because these are things that sometimes you're never in front of a judge on. It's not like where you actually have to have. So if you're getting sued as a business, you technically have to have an attorney represent you for that. But like drafting contracts or drafting your will, you're not required. You can do it for. You can't do it for someone else, but you can do it for yourself. So a lot of people have started to use chat GPT to say like, I need a will. Draft me a will. Oh, and it will, it will throw out a lot of things at you. But kind of the issues we've seen a lot of is it doesn't actually understand like certain terms and things you really need to be in your wheel. Like, like for instance, selling real property. Same thing in like the business world, like draft me a non compete. Okay. But it doesn't know the laws behind it to know like what is reasonable in time and scope for your business. So like, well, I think chat GPT like can do some great things. I think it's awesome. Like if you're writing an email and you just want it to sound a little bit more professional or you want to sound a little Bit nicer or something like that. But I think when it comes down to the real research part of it and understanding laws and cases, people are using it way too much. And I think we're going to end up in a lot of litigation because they never put the right clauses in there or didn't understand what they were actually signing. Like, that's one of the biggest things. I think when we draft a contract or will for you, we're going to sit down and review it with you. And so you understand what you're signing. Chat GPT just throws it out at you. You don't really know what it's saying. You saw it, right? It's chat gbt. You sign it and then it's not what you think and you end up in litigation. So I definitely think AI can be good in a lot of situations, but I don't think it needs to replace the role of like having an attorney or an accountant or a financial person to help you understand what you're actually getting into.
[00:03:14] Speaker A: And I'll say I was researching voting under the influence, some administrative hearing stuff to pull the statutes for some cases. But. And I kept getting like AI summaries. And once I, you know, I got the statutes and stuff and pulled them, AI was incorrect on some stuff. Like it was saying if you are charged with body under influence, you have to do this, you have to do that. And it's like, well, no, you have to do that if xyz. But there's also ways to get around it and defenses.
And so, you know, reading the synopsis, when I was even pulling statutes, I was like, this synopsis is incorrect.
And so that was a little annoying. So, you know, that's what we're seeing in our realm. You know, they may give you a little summary. Like it did summarize voting under the influence. But, you know, there, there was information that wasn't completely accurate and there's a lot of like, ifs, ands and buts. If that makes sense.
[00:04:11] Speaker B: That does. Because so Chelsea in my law office, like did something, went and asked it a question and it cited a case that didn't even exist.
Oh my gosh. Yeah. I mean, like, you know, I just go and double check Westlaw and all this stuff and she's like, this case didn't even exist. And the thing is, a lot of times like you, it's AI is pulling from what's on the Internet. Well, there's Wikipedia. Like anybody can go on there and write anything. So the Internet is not always the best way to just find something, just, you know, it. I don't think it's ever going to take the place of real understanding and learning it and seeing it actually in action. You can chat GPT as much as you want, but they don't know how to go in the courtroom and make an argument.
[00:04:57] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I think I'm with you. It's a good tool for like a basic educational period, but that's, that's it. You know, it may educate you on surface level things, but you're gonna need an actual attorney for depth, if that makes sense.
So, yeah. So our advice, anybody listening, is, you know, use AI as one tool in a toolbox. But an attorney is always going to be a toolbox that has everything in it. Right? So all the pieces. So definitely reach out to an attorney. Don't just rely on AI for these things.
So switching gears, me and Lauren have been obsessed with, with watching Mormon Wives, which coming from Sister Wives, shouldn't surprise anybody that we have both binge watched this show.
So if you haven't watched Mormon Wives, it's on Hulu and it's the Church of Latter Day Saints, I believe. And it kind of started with one of the members, Taylor, Frankie Paul. She started like Mom Talk, where the moms of this church would get together and like, have fun and be more laid back. And I think like the, the church itself is like super strict and conservative on certain things. And she just wanted to create like a safe place where these young women could embrace their femininity, like their sexuality and dancing and making these tick tocks.
And so I really like, like how it kind of started with the Mom Talk, which is what led to the show.
I do think it had a lot of good values, but in watching the show, I don't, you know, I, I almost have issues with the church itself, with supporting that. Like, I, I. There's some things that really bother me as a woman in watching the show.
And one of those things I was telling you, Lauren, was the fact that one of the members was like 16 when she got pregnant and married and, and her husband was like over 20, 21, I think he was 21.
And I just don't like that. And Layla is another character on the show. She got pregnant and they, you know, encouraged her to get married. And now she's, you know, she had two kids divorced, and I mean she's like 20, maybe not even 21 years old.
And I just really think they push women in, into marriage at such a young age. And so, and I don't like that. And you have statutory rape with somebody.
[00:07:50] Speaker B: Like with this, she was 16, got pregnant. So it's obvious, like I have some issues. Like statutory rape, I think is a hard thing. If it's like a 16 and an 18 year old, I don't feel like that 18 year old did anything wrong because you're probably in school together and those type things, you're probably on the same maturity level. So I mean, like some statutory rape cases, I do feel really sorry for the perpetrator.
But like in this situation, she's 16 and he is over.
They weren't ever in school. Like, I guess for me, I said, like, if you're 16 and he's 18 and y' all have been, you know, like, I don't know, when we were in school, a lot of our friends and like the band and stuff like that were a few years older than us because we hung out like as a group in that situation and people dated.
When you're 16 and he's 21 or 20 plus, like, that's a big maturity difference. And that's when I feel like that is statutory rape. Like, but yet that's never brought up in this. It's not like a big deal. Like, the bigger deal is she was pregnant. Not that somebody could have forced her to have sex because. Right. They were so much older than her.
[00:08:56] Speaker A: So. And that's all going to vary on state. So in South Carolina, the age of consent is 16. So. So as long as she got pregnant at 16, that would. If it. We were talking about South Carolina law, that would be the age of consent. Now under that, if she had been 14 or 15, that would have been a crime.
We do have what's called a Romeo clause in South Carolina, and that's kind of what you're talking about, Lauren, where you're in school together and you date. And so if somebody's 14 dating an 18 year old in South Carolina and you can have consensual intercourse.
So. But that's where that Romeo clause kicks in. We used to not have that, but now we do. So where you're talking about people dating, huh?
[00:09:41] Speaker B: When did that come into effect?
[00:09:43] Speaker A: I know it's always been something as long as I've practiced law, so at least 10 years, but yeah. So that's what it's called. It's called the Romeo clause. If you know Romeo and Juliet, you probably know why it's called that.
But yes. So where there's somebody close in age, like you were saying, went to school together, could have gone to school together. It's not going to apply, though, if it's not close to age, you know, 18, I would say anybody over that, it's not going to apply.
[00:10:14] Speaker B: Well, and I think she gave birth at 16. So who. Like, I went in there, she actually got pregnant. So, like.
And I'm not. I don't know. I mean, I know it can happen on your first time, whatever, but I highly doubt that that was just the first time and got pregnant right. At 16.
It's. That's not a big deal on the show at all. They just like brush over it.
That it's just like. And I feel like, I don't know, like at 16, you're so impressionable. Like, did she actually make the decision to me. Well, that's another thing. When you get married, you have to be a certain age to get married. So I don't know what the law is in that state, but here, Isn't it under 18, a parent has to sign for you. Yeah. So that means if the law was the same in her say they got married at 16, her parents had to sign for her to get married to this person. Yeah.
[00:11:11] Speaker A: And the only reason I believe it's brushed over in the show is that they are still together, they are still married. They have had several children since then.
[00:11:20] Speaker B: So currently pregnant right now?
[00:11:23] Speaker A: Yes, she is pregnant right now with a few others on the show.
So I definitely think that is there now. I don't know, like, Layla was really young when she got married. I don't know if they've said how old he is.
[00:11:38] Speaker B: Her and her husband were actually the same age in school.
[00:11:40] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:11:41] Speaker B: So like she got pregnant, I think at 17, 18, somewhere in there. But I think they were both with a year, maybe a year apart, but they were both close in age. Like it was kind of like a different situation, I think. And the fact that I think she was probably forced into marriage, but I think she was 18 when she got married. She was technically an adult.
[00:12:02] Speaker A: Yeah. No, and I just think that's it. That's such a big issue. Like you said with the marriage thing.
I mean, she really, in my opinion, getting married that young and somebody needed to sign off on you. It is a child bride. I know it's not the youngest we have seen, you know, with the very extreme cult, the FLDS. I mean, you see child brides that are 12, 13 years old, but I mean, 16 is not that far off. Like, I can't imagine. And I know there's exceptions to every rule, right? There's exceptions of somebody meeting somebody they love and working it out. But I just still think that to get married you should be 18 years old and to move to that next step of physical. It needs to be. Be with the law. I think 16, I get. I. I feel like 16 is appropriate for the age of consent.
I still don't like the 1621. But like you said the 15.
He probably was 15.
That's just too young. And you are teetering if you're in South Carolina in that age with child bride. But I do know I'm not going to say their names. We went to school with this guy. They were on a TV show that I watched about child brides. He got somebody pregnant. She was too young, he was too old. It was against the law and the way they got around it was by getting married.
[00:13:26] Speaker B: So like Jerry Lee Lewis back in the day. I mean it's his like he married his cut. Like obviously he's like 90 years old and.
[00:13:35] Speaker A: Right.
[00:13:35] Speaker B: Well, I still enjoy listening to Great Balls of Fire. I do not think he is a good person whatsoever because I think he murdered one of his wives too kind of thing.
[00:13:42] Speaker A: Well, think about Elvis and Priscilla.
[00:13:45] Speaker B: Oh yeah, I will say that was.
[00:13:47] Speaker A: She was like 14 when they started dating. 14, 15 years old in another country and her parents let her move here at like 16 with this man in his mid 20s at least.
[00:14:00] Speaker B: But yeah, like I agree. But I guess in some ways, like thinking about like Elvis and Priscilla, like it was such a different time period with the. I will say so just from back. My grandma was 16 and married her husband who was in his 20s. Her. She actually lied to get married and said she was 18 and she was not. But it was a different time. My grandmother was stuck in a house out in the country working in the fields. Like she was a lot more mature at 16 than probably most of us are at 30. Like she had lived a hard life and it. I don't think she was not pregnant. She actually did not get pregnant for 20 years after they were married and did not have my aunt. Well, 18 years. She hadn't had my aunt till 34. Mama 36, I think. And I think she loved my grandpa. They were married till the day he died.
But I just think some of that world was different they lived in then because I do think people matured a whole lot. They went through so much. They went through the Great Depression. They went through so much. In today's time, I feel like 16 is still a baby.
[00:15:04] Speaker A: But I do know times where I agree with that. But it doesn't make it right, in my opinion.
But I don't know. With the arguments today, I think girls are maturing a lot faster and growing up a lot faster than normal. Like, I don't think I personally did. I was super immature.
[00:15:26] Speaker B: I.
[00:15:27] Speaker A: It took me a long time to grow up. And I love that because I definitely think I embraced every stage of life as a. As a kid, but I don't think my sister did. Like, I think my sister grew up a lot faster than I did. And just seeing some of these girls on social media, I mean, they look so much older than they. They really are.
[00:15:50] Speaker B: I think our bodies have, like, women, this is getting on this house. But women start having periods early. Women are able to have babies, like, earlier. I think in some ways are developing those type things. But I think as far as, like, life and having been through stuff, I think, like, back then, my grandma only graduated, only went to sixth grade, and then she had to start working. Like, I hear you getting married was actually a better life. Not that her parents were bad to her, but she was out, like, doing everything, all this where, like, today. I do think our bodies are mature and faster. Girls are getting periods quicker. But as far as, like, I don't think up here we're, like, as maturing as. I think it's a lot of the physical side of things, and I like not to get off in the weights. I do think some of that is because what we put in our bodies now, like.
[00:16:41] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. Yeah, yeah. And kind of that take was back in because my grandma, too, got married. I mean, she was, I think, around 18 when she got married to my mom's dad, but she grew up in poverty, and it was a way out. And so I do think society's views of, like, getting out of bad situations has changed that for sure. Like, I do think our grandparents saw marriage as a way to escape stuff, especially if they saw an older, stable male and they're looking at their situation like, oh, I can get out of this situation if I get married to this person because they're older and more settled, and I can get out of, you know, poverty, where I. I think today we are in such a women's empowerment movement, preaching that we do not have to depend on a man to get ourselves out of situations. And really embracing, like, mental health and recovering from trauma with therapists and stuff, it's not so much dependent on men.
So I. I just think society pressures are for sure different on women today than back then. And that's, you Know probably why, what led to marriages so early on in life?
[00:18:04] Speaker B: Say, like, kind of looking at it. I do think in our world today it is different. But it's kind of crazy in the celebrity world that all of these, like, kind of how like we talk about in the Latter Day Saints, they say it's okay, like, and they've done this enforce these people. But then you see in the celebrity world, I remember Hillary Duff, who is our age when she was like 16, was dating the dude from Good Charlotte who was like 28 or something. And it's like, it's okay. They're celebrities. And it's not because, like Jerry Seinfeld, he was like friends with this girl who was 16, but they didn't have sex till she was 18. So like. Okay.
So I feel like in certain cultures it's just overlooked. But then like in the celebrity world in this church of Latter Day Saints. But I think it shouldn't be. I guess just because you're in this situation or you're. Because you're a celebrity, you shouldn't get a pass.
[00:18:56] Speaker A: Agreed. And you know, Kylie Jenner dated Tyga and she was like 16, 17 years old. And I want to say he was at his mid-20s.
[00:19:06] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:19:06] Speaker A: You know, and I know they would say, well, Kylie's so mature for her age and all of that.
I mean, yeah, I mean, I get that. But I just believe there's such beauty in age appropriateness. Like, I love the geeky, nerdy kid that I was at 14, 15 years old and transitioning 16, 7, 18 and learning more about my, like, every age, that I truly just got to be that age and experience things at that age. And I don't know, I just think it, you know, so at my age now, like, I have no desire to go out all night and party and drink and stuff like that. I love that I did that in college, though, at that age. But I just feel like when you do age appropriate activities at that eight, like once you get to that next stage, you're comfortable moving on to that next chapter. And I think we strip kids away from being kids when we make it okay, like you said in pop culture or in religious basis, to skip those ages and skip those steps and just jump right into adulthood.
[00:20:15] Speaker B: Well, yeah, like. Well, when you say, like, not like all the memes about, like, when I was 16, this is what I look like. And girls today have like skincare routines, like all this stuff instead of just like, granted what we did probably wasn't the best because we were like using The Stridex and Noxzema and all that.
Like, girls at 16 do not need to put on 50 different moisturizing creams. Your skin is good and nice. And I feel like this, they're becoming adults on certain ways. Like they're missing out on just like fun stuff. I can't say much. I probably was born an 80 year old woman. I like my life. I have done age appropriate things. But in, in my heart of hearts, I'm an old woman to start with. Like, I was not one that in college got my feelings hurt if people went out and I didn't go because I wanted to go to bed. And I have no regrets.
[00:21:05] Speaker A: You don't? No. You never did.
[00:21:08] Speaker B: I don't think peer pressure was a big thing for me because inside I was Sophia, like my whole life.
But I do think girls today are being peer pressured a lot.
[00:21:17] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah, yeah. And, and there's a balance. It's. It's okay to teach girls skin care like you said, but let's not make it overboard because when you're making it so much about prevention of being old instead of just taking care of an organ for skin cancer, you know, I think there's a way to approach it. Like, I want my girls to learn, you know, nutritional facts. I want them to learn to wash their face and moisturize, but only because that's healthy for skin purposes, not, oh, we have to do all these 50 moisturizers to prevent wrinkles, because heaven forbid we get old. Because then I think you're put ingraining in them these issues and then you're. And I don't want them to judge others when they do start getting wrinkles and getting older and stuff like that. Like, let's just embrace all the ages. And so that is circling back to Mormon wives. Some of the things criminally and personally that I think me and Lauren both have seen in the show that we, we take issue with doesn't mean we're still not going to binge watch it. We're going to be there for season three.
[00:22:23] Speaker B: A lot of them, like, this is like, just not that any of them will ever watch, but if some of them ever watched our podcast, we know that you are forced to do a lot of the mean things you do to become a villain. I don't like you, Whitney, but I know probably it is first and then Team Taylor. And I will say one thing I feel about Taylor. She's done a lot of bad stuff. Like, she really has, but she has owned it. And also, like, I Feel like she hasn't, at this point, let other people influence her too much. Because when her baby daddy was not the right decision, she did not go marry him. Even though her parents, they didn't like him, but because of their culture, they were forcing her to think about marriage. And she didn't go marry him because while I think she probably meant she, the child's not a mistake, but the relationship with him was a mistake, and she knew better than to go forward and get in that marriage.
[00:23:14] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree with you. I love Taylor. I think she teaches and promotes some great things. We can all take away the importance of accountability.
That is just huge. I love that she always takes accountability for things.
I like that she expressed how she feels. I think a lot of times we as women suppress how we're feeling to appease others, you know, and keep the calm. And I'm not saying you have to yell and scream your feelings, but I do think we should be more comfortable saying, hey, I don't like you. I don't want to be around you. This is my boundary. This, you know, I will be here and sit beside you. But that doesn't mean we're like, I. I like that. I like that Taylor will speak up for herself and advocate for herself.
I don't like how her dad talked to her in that one episode with, like, she was talking about how it was her fault almost for jumping into bed with Dakota so soon. Like, what does that, you know, say about you? And in my head, I'm like, that she's told you how she felt. Like she's upset at herself for doing that. And also, even if she wasn't a.
[00:24:24] Speaker B: It's her body.
[00:24:25] Speaker A: She can do what she wants. If she's after her divorce and she wants to hook up with, like, she's entitled to do whatever. And clearly she was in the right frame of mind or in the frame of mind that she wanted this to work out with this person, not just, you know, a fling. And she's recognized that, and now she regrets it. And her. But she. And she's owned it. So I didn't find it appropriate that her dad, like, tried to sex shame her, essentially. Like, if she wanted to do that, she can do it. She clearly did not want to be in that situation, and she regrets it. So, like, why hammered her on he.
[00:25:03] Speaker B: Already, I feel like, was. I think, like he was rubbing salt in her wounds with that. Yeah, he obviously regrets this relationship. And she was going through a very hard time because that whole swinger scandal had came out and everything. And she probably didn't make the best decisions. And she knows that. She admits it. It's not like we're having an intervention to stop you from continuing to make bad decisions. That was just kind of hurting her. But overall, I think it's a great show to watch. If you need a good binge on a weekend, you're not going to get there. It's not one of those shows you have to overly think about. You just sit and enjoy it.
And there are a lot of fun women on there and there is a lot of women supporting women, but there's also a lot of caddiness, and that's why we like it.
[00:25:46] Speaker A: Yep. Yep. We didn't get to talk about the season desist, so we might have to save that for another episode.
But. But I don't know. I know we're running late, but I think we can squeeze.
Can Demi get a cease and desist on Jen?
I mean, this is a public figure, I think, but so she's got a.
[00:26:07] Speaker B: Higher bar when you're a public figure of, like, proven, like, this type stuff. And it is really hard. Like, this is the hardest thing, anything. With this type stuff, truth and opinion are 100, like, defenses. So, like, if you're saying I think she's a. That's fine if you're doing things. And the hard part with all of this is like, we've talked about kind of before with, like, the Johnny Depp case. We're kind of. You have to prove there were actual damages to you because of what this person did. So, like, getting an injunction, you're never gonna. It's kind of that freedom of speech. You can say whatever you want to say as long as it's, like, true. And I think that's kind of the issue in some of this stuff is, like, what's true, what's opinion and what is actually a true. Like, there's a difference between Lacey sucks and saying Lacey was disbarred as an attorney, because one is my opinion, which is not. But just kind of saying. And the other would be stating a fact that wasn't true. And that is a cease and desist letters. So we do these hard clients sometime.
They don't really hold a whole lot of grounds. Like, sometimes it scares somebody enough to stop. But these two women both have enough money to go get attorneys. They're going to have to go in there and let a judge decide. Was this actually, you know, slanderous, like, bad stuff, or was it just mere puffery? And I don't know, I think, honestly, neither one of them need to go to court over this.
[00:27:29] Speaker A: Yeah, I know. Because, like, I think it was over whether or not she made out with some guy when they were on a trip. And I mean, I don't know what a judge will do if she's saying, well, I didn't make out with them. And she's saying, well, yeah, you did, and I saw it. Well, I think at that point, like you, it's going to turn on Damages, and Demi's still with her husband and she's still making money and she's still employed on the show. So I think, like you said, the Damages really takes control in these situations because you can be catty, you can spread gossip whether it's true or untrue, but if you're not harmed by it, of course we're not going to want to get involved.
Nope.
[00:28:09] Speaker B: Well, that, I think, takes us through more. We're going to have. So, as we know, P. Diddy, we're waiting to hear on the verdict. So, like, hopefully that's going to be our next episode for y' all, so we can kind of break all that stuff down because hopefully we'll have it soon.
We're filming this on Thursday, so if this comes out on Friday and the verdict's Friday morning, that is why I said this.
But we're looking forward to digging into that, maybe getting into some women in crime in the future. But definitely send us dms. Let us know what you want to hear about.
[00:28:39] Speaker A: Yeah, we're going to be digging into a series for women in crime, kicking off with probably Karen Reed, since her verdict just came out, and Anna Delvey and we got a couple others we're gonna do a series on. But if there's any women in crime charged with a crime or, like, con artists white, like, seriously, let us know so we can add that to the series we already have planned.
[00:29:03] Speaker B: See y' all later.
Bye.
